I had a large project. The company had a training program they wanted fixed. The purpose of the course was to show how to use creativity in solving engineering problems. The "course" was really just a lot of activities. Kind of like a bunch of ice-breakers.It reminded me of a kids activity book.

They wanted the activities put into a company template, but the template was designed for engineering classes--so the activities really didn't have all the components, since they weren't difficult, and they were just recipes.I said that in order to do the template the activities would need to be changed, and rearranged to match with what the engineering challenges were for the company. After that the template could be filled in.Basically, the foundation needed to be fixed, and then we could fix the walls and paint. They agreed.

I did this, and the loved it! Except for the person who wrote the activity lessons.She was pissed, because she didn't want her activities changed, she just wanted me to add on what had to be added on to fit in the template. I explained it would have been hard to understand, and irrelevant to the engineers. She didn't care.(Equivalent of a foundation being patched, and the walls crooked, but slapped with a new coat of paint).She wanted it ready for a class, and she knew all the activities, and didn't want to feel uncomfortable training it. I asked her to move the training date, and then she would be able to understand, and the engineers would too. She said the time line was more important.

Since the activity lady has a bunch of power the training people gave in. I then lost the entire contract which was supposed to be ongoing. In the process, they got an entire new curriculum framework, including online modules, and a way to track the data.The template work is easy, the part they got was hard.

The project manager was very apologetic, and said don't worry--we'll pay you for all the work. But, that work was done based on the fact I would have an ongoing contract, which would offset the up front labor time. If I accept the payment, then they own all the work I did. But, I get screwed.What do I do? 

Did you have a written contract which expressly indicated the payment you would be receiving was going to be paid as such given that it would be on-going and if the terms changed then your salary/pay-rate would also change?

It would all depend on how the contract was written. A good contract would cover these instances.

I recently hired a web designer and my contract I wrote with him is 13 pages long and inclusive of any and all kinds of possible scenarios ... just in case.

Clearly you are upset about the job no longer being ongoing and I do not blame you. However, that being said, I would suggest that you communicate what you've communicated in the last paragraph of your message.

Ultimately, if you did not have the specifics of the situation outlined in your contract, then it is up to them as far as if they change the payment terms to reflect up-front labor rather than what was simply done up to that point as written in the original contract/agreement.

I would clearly let them know that your initial presumption was that your project would be continuous, which would end up making you more money in the long-run, which explains why you agreed to not have a higher rate up front.

You have to ask yourself if it's worth it to go to small-claims court and jeapordize any future employment (contract or otherwise) with the company and your reputation in the IT community (assuming that's what you do)...

I would say if it's not expressly written in the contract for the situation that arose, to convey your concerns to them respectfully and concisely and leave the rest to them.

They may agree with you and pay you ammicably or they may disagree and pay you only what they feel is their end of the contract.

Whatever you do, hopefully it serves as a learning experience to what needs to be included in your next contract for temporary work, if it was not originally included.

Good luck. 

Did you have a written contract which expressly indicated the payment you would be receiving was going to be paid as such given that it would be on-going and if the terms changed then your salary/pay-rate would also change?


No:( This was someone I worked for on other projects, and I felt comfortable. I think I got involved in a turf and power war. The training department knew the activities were crap, and I think I was the sacrificial lamb, so they can possibly change things down the road.

Thanks so much for taking time to comment. I'm really upset. This activity lady knows they are crappy, and she's going to go forward wasting people's time (its mandatory!). She had me pulled. But, she gets paid WAY more then me. How do selfish people seem to get ahead?

Yes, I learned. Know them or not, be specific in your contract.

Thanks so much for sharing. You brought up so many good points. 

This sort of thing happens to consultants in every workforce - ONCE. You've paid your dues, learned your lesson, so don't let it happen again. 

The plot thickens. I found out the activity lady is a sub-contractor. The company has govt. funds with her to research these activities. Activity lady has no lesson design experience, but is a manager. The company doesn't want to lose the govt. $$$, so they are going to "research" materials that they are pretty sure are sh*t, based on three expert reviews. Both companies get paid, so they don't care about the results. It's a multi-million dollar project, that most likely will fail. 

That sucks and is whats wrong with the world today. :-( 

So, knowing all of this what would you do?

1. Tell the media, and lose the ability to work in the industry again

2. Tell the govt. agency. If this project is stopped there are three more in bed with each other to take the place.

3. Ignore, and chalk it up to oh well. I need to work too. All this reporting takes up time and energy. And other then severing friendships, is unlikely to change the system. 

My dh got royally screwed at work through no fault of his own. All he did wrong was to do what was asked of him, and he did it better than the last guy.

He has been told repeatedly by several different managers that he did nothing wrong. In fact he was told "you did not fail *insert company name*, we failed you." Still, he's screwed. :((( It's really taking a toll on him too. I try to be encouraging, but there is nothing I can do or say to fix it. I've never seen him like this before. 

It sounds to me like the activity creator doesn't understand an engineer's mind.

show how to use creativity in solving engineering problems.

This made me laugh.

The situation right now sucks for you; however, my guess is that once they get into it, they aren't going to end up being happy with it because it will be like forcing a right handed person to use left handed scissors.

Sometimes these things happen. I would let your contact know that you're sorry there wasn't a meeting of the minds between you and the activity maker. Then send a note to the training committee or whatever it is and let them know that you enjoyed working with them, and while this project may not have been the best fit that you hope to work with them in the future.

Be professional and don't burn your bridges.

If I accept the payment, then they own all the work I did. But, I get screwed.What do I do?

Maybe next time put an early cancellation fee or a larger set up fee in your contract to cover all the work up front. 

Two words....

Whistle blower


Go for it based on inefficient use of public funds. 

Sorry this happened. Really though, everyone has to do work at one point or another that they disagree with or think is inefficient etc. But, its not your call. You made your point to the trainer, and she didn't listen - not your problem. You aren't the one doing the training so it's not like that part comes back on you.

If I was you I would just apologize to the people who hired you. Tell them why you did what you did, and ask them to keep you in mind if another opportunity arises to work for them. but next time make a plan of how to handle this scenario in the future (ie, make it clear who has the final call and everyone just deals with it). 

Sorry this happened. Really though, everyone has to do work at one point or another that they disagree with or think is inefficient etc. But, its not your call. You made your point to the trainer, and she didn't listen - not your problem.

I hear ya. But, they have 3 years to make changes and develop. They can take all the work I did, and implement at a later time. I get no money, credit, or ongoing benefit from all the work I put in. 

3. Ignore, and chalk it up to oh well. I need to work too. All this reporting takes up time and energy. And other then severing friendships, is unlikely to change the system.

This is the one to go with. 

But, they have 3 years to make changes and develop. They can take all the work I did, and implement at a later time. I get no money, credit, or ongoing benefit from all the work I put in.

I guess I missed that part before. That does really stink. Sounds like a bad contract. Have you tried to negotiate anything with them? 

I guess I missed that part before. That does really stink. Sounds like a bad contract. Have you tried to negotiate anything with them?

Not yet, I sent a nice letter expressing the rationale, and concerns. This has never happened. So, I don't know how to handle it, and what to ask for from them, so I don't get left in the cold.

At the same point, millions of dollars gets wasted on the guise of research. They spun this whole thing to eventually trickle down to help at-risk kids who have trouble in math, science and engineering classes..which is how they got the $$$.

The only people being helped are the companies being funded. 

Not yet, I sent a nice letter expressing the rationale, and concerns. This has never happened. So, I don't know how to handle it, and what to ask for from them, so I don't get left in the cold.

Help--do I get a lawyer? And burn whatever money I made?

Negotiate, get paid, and then send a letter?

Outline all my concerns about the project, so when it tanks, I'm not included in that disaster? 

Without a written contract , you have nothing to beef about on this event. Learn from it going forward.

No contract = no work!!!

STFU - and go away quietly, if you want to work in this industry...jmho 

BTW - this ia a very public and bad way to discuss contract business... 

BTW - this ia a very public and bad way to discuss contract business...

I'm going to disagree. Major companies are able to get away with what they do, because of the "be quiet", and big stick mentality. Thanks to blogs, You Tube, cell phone cameras, and message boards the little guy is able to tell their story.

Other then doing my job, and providing solutions, I did nothing wrong.

I did have a contract, but you are correct, I did not have the provision for this event. I guess if I read something online like this I may have added one. Maybe someone contracting now will add one. Hopefully, someone can benefit from my mistake.

There are lots of people who consult, or work hourly, especially in this economy, who have faced, or may face this issue.It's hard enough to get good assignments, let alone do all the legal work. But, this event shows how important it is.

Should they be warned, sure. It's real life 101 in business. No company names have been listed. And I have simply reported my side of the events. 

Its really hard to give specific advice on a course of action without knowing the specifics of the situation. As always, hiring an attorney is only worth it if you stand to be compensated more than what the attorney charges you for the fight. For most people, this just isn't true so civil court just isnt the best place of recourse.

If this is a substantial amount of money lost, could potentially affect your career in the future then I would certainly make a phone call to an attorney. Most of them will consult for free, so at least maybe you can get some questions answered. 

I know this isn't what you want to hear, but if I were you, I would just eat it and consider a lesson learned. Think of it as tuition in the school of life.

And change your contract. A good contract allows you to maintain friendships with your clients. 

Hello,

Thanks for all your insight. After some soul searching, I have decided to take the path of resistance. We have seen over and over the consequences of protecting our turf over the big picture.
1. The oil spill was the result of pushing deadlines and maximizing money, even when others said wait
2. The financial collapse was the result of people taking money and ignoring or protecting their own assets
Each time we all wonder why no one speaks up earlier. Just like here--it's a pain, no one cares that much and most likely the little guy will take the hit. So, here ya go, big guy, hit me.

I've have written a letter to the people concerned regarding bias, and conflict of interest.

I will submit another one to the authority that handles this.

I have not sent an invoice, or been paid. Nor, have we talked compensation. I'm doing this because it's the right thing to do in my mind.

I'm not super strong, and hate conflict. Maybe nothing will change.

The point is, until the little guy speaks up, the big broken system will always be big, and broken.

If I get sued, or black listed, they can have my debt. And, I have worked at McDonald's before. You can take my living, but not my dignity. 

It's a multi-million dollar project, that most likely will fail. OBAMACARE 

If I get sued, or black listed, they can have my debt. And, I have worked at McDonald's before. You can take my living, but not my dignity.

crazy thing a rest manager makes pretty good money and during a time of work cut backs the fast food places with low dollar price menus tend to endure. 

crazy thing a rest manager makes pretty good money and during a time of work cut backs the fast food places with low dollar price menus tend to endure.

Grease Monger 

crazy thing a rest manager makes pretty good money and during a time of work cut backs the fast food places with low dollar price menus tend to endure.

I actually liked working there. I got good hours, your job expectations were clear, and it was all about people, "May I take you order please?" That was back when I was in college, getting a degree, so I wouldn't have to work there. The irony. 

It's a multi-million dollar project, that most likely will fail. OBAMACARE

I've seen it through every administration. A sick brain can't think itself well.Those who make the most from these projects are the big corporations, and they have the most to lose, and protect. 

I think it is a mistake, but you're going to do what you want to do.

This isn't righteous indignation over government waste or conflict of interest. You didn't have a problem with it when you were going to get paid.

The problem is your contract didn't CYA in the case of early termination. That is the issue and all the rest of the facts are irrelevant.

Whether you run a one person business or a Fortune 500 company, your success boils down to building relationships with your clients. The bottom line is the whacky activity lady had a stronger relationship with the client than you did. That is why you are out and she is in. Other than your contract, that is the other issue you need to address. This is not a problem with "them," this is an issue with how you present yourself and your services.

Throwing around accusations is not the best way to foster relationships. I don't know what industry you are in, but I'm sure it is like any other, word of what you are doing is going to spread like wild fire. I would be willing to bet that the letter you sent will end up costing you more money in lost work in the long run than if you had gotten paid in full on this job.

But best of luck to you. 

I didnt read the entire thread because it got so long but I am sorry this has turned out the way it has for you.

Just an fyi-- when a facilitator does too many icebreakers at our meetings it enrages me!! I feel as though he/she has no respect for my time. I am there because it is mandatory so I just want to cut to the chase and get the training done so I can leave..lol I was at a meeting recently and the trainer went around the room and had each person stand up, introduce him/herself and tell what kind of invention they would like to make and how it would benefit the world. HUH!?!? There were about 75 people in the room and I timed it. It was over an hour. My blood boils even now, thinking about it. 

Atasca Mom, I agree with you. Don't waste my time with that stuff. Give me what you want me to have and then I will ask if I have questions. 

This isn't righteous indignation over government waste or conflict of interest. You didn't have a problem with it when you were going to get paid

I actually didn't know that she was serving so many roles, when I started. In research, a conflict of interest is not unexpected, but you're supposed to divulge and change course, so you don't nullify findings. If you are getting paid to manage a course of action, and revise a product , you may ignore an important product flaw because of the budget. So, those are usually two entirely separate roles. I actually didn't have the aha until later. It may have been unintentional, but once the investigator is put on notice, they are ethically required address it. I don't know what that means for her contract though.

I had a problem with her from the start, and the unwillingness to change a product they were funded to change. It wasn't until later on that I realized that the conflict of interest was the root issue here. 

It wasn't until later on that I realized that the conflict of interest was the root issue here.

I thought it was really weird that the activity lady was so out of control about the revised product and had a fit about training, and having to re-learn. Well, she's getting a set project fee to manage, so the closer it stays to the original time line , the more she gets paid, and the less work she has to do. The more changes made, the less she gets paid, and the more work she has to do. But, her other role is to fix the product her company made. I've never seen the creator on the revision schedule as a manager, trainer, and product development person too. Then I had an aha. That's because of bias. I have a vision of this is supposed to work out. So, because of that vision, I may ignore what's best for the product, because it doesn't look the way I expected. That's why she freaked about the template. She has several roles that divide her loyalty, and compromise the integrity of the product development and research.

I was floored, because I'd never seen this. Now I know why. Those roles typically don't cross in research.